Sun conjunction Saturn

[AlexElPM]

How horrible do you think that conjunction can be? (look at the title)

 

[FlamingRedRose666]

Sun/Saturn
Low self-esteem, low energy/vitality, problems with and/or estrangement from the father in childhood. There are often problems with men for both sexes, but especially for women. Reserved in self-expression, can make a person awkward or over serious. For women, the husband/partner can be more like a father figure, dominating or restricting. When transiting Saturn makes its first hard aspect to the Sun in a young girl's life, often around the age of 13-14, she may develop an outright hostility towards her father. This often lasts through the life. Look to the houses where the hard aspects are taking place and where the Sun is placed to see where the individual feels lacking in self-worth. With the hard aspects [the opposition, conjunction, square and inconjunct], marriage usually comes late in life. The trine and sextile aspects often give longevity and are more toned down in their affects as to the above, adding seriousness and discipline to the personality.

 

[FlamingRedRose666]

Whoops, forgot to include this link: http://www.angelfire.com/empire/serpentis666/FURCAS.html

 

[13th_Wolf]

How horrible do you think that conjunction can be? (look at the title)

Sun/Saturn and Sun/Jupiter aspects are common in the extraordinarily wealthy.

Saturn reduces the Sun and brings it to discipline the person and their Ego. The individual is made self conscious to a negative, but also naturally will seek to better oneself and overcome in an intense manner, being held back makes you fight for who you want to be seen as. It makes a person quite awkward and reserved but also this pressure on the personality leads one to understand the depth of expression, how to properly come across to others, politeness, true confidence within ones own self and not bluffing. It ferments as an aspect, quite extraordinary people who are not prone to delusion by their provenance and natally very grounded if they for example are lacking Earth or there's otherwise "ungrounded" indications in the chart. As it's known Saturn is the planet of aging and things improving with age. Sun/Saturn individuals begin very shy and even downtrodden but as they grow older can become incredibly to the contrary and flip to absurd levels of pride, health and strength of character. One example here is Robert Plant from Led Zeppelin, which goes without saying :lol:

Jupiter on the other hand expands the Sun and is indicative of people who were born into wealth and domestic security (not always though). This is then often squandered as one may not put themselves to action or ever learn to appreciate their own background and wealth, where they might come from. Additionally they may even come to embrace this toxic mindset through bad experiences or other factors like peers. Some people go to ascetic extremes and put themselves in poverty on purpose as they realise this within themselves, the inherent undermining faults of their own fortune and whims. This ties into how Jupiter connects with the sign of Pisces that it co-rules. Sun/Jupiter can be an aspect of self-deception as Sagittarius/Pisces are mutable, carefree "flippant" signs and Jupiter is in a spiritual sense connected to Neptune and the trait of deception. In another sense Jupiter people begin in life with a sense of going somewhere, and world weariness. They are liable to travel early on to many countries and are not "bound" in that sense of their family not being able to afford it, small town mindsets and so on. One starts off in life with a lot of personal pride and sense of identity which is then metered by reality as they experience it, in sublimation they become less conceited and adopt humility. Sun/Jupiter is seen in the Jake Pauls of the world, the arrogant asshole types but contrarily also in quite cultivated individuals such as James Watson and is also a spiritual type of aspect (Jupiter rules philosophy)

Both aspects can create people with a strong philosophy but Sun/Saturn is one created from one's personal experience and is internal whereas Sun/Jupiter's is extrapersonal, invites good education and wisdom coming from others which is external. Sun/Saturn is intrinsically feminine and Sun/Jupiter is masculine, but ultimately as either one develops in life, these aspects swap places in that regard. When they age its vice versa.

Both aspects can have trouble with self-denial, not just Saturn. Sun/Saturn arguably is the "stronger" aspect or more intense and personifying in an individual's story for the reason that Saturn is associated with Cardinal and Fixed qualities which are stronger than Jupiter's Mutable ones. The experience such a person has is more poignant and true to reality, no deception or fanciful idealization in their thinking is involved, for better or worse. It's a better "for better or worse" than the Mutable quality of Sagittarius/Pisces, which expresses themselves often in this current time as whimsical and irrelevant to the truth. The positive sublimation of this force though is proper wisdom as it gives fortune in worldly affairs when one with this provenance is grounded and actively engaging in the physical world

This kind of understanding above applies to all things involving Saturn and Jupiter, they mirror eachother as Fortune and Unfortune. There's a lot of other things to consider going into this kinda duality here as well, such as how they both treat time. Saturn prominent people perceive time and the future as a constant stresser, and bearing down on them. There is a constant need to ensure security of and certainty in their own affairs. Jupiter prominent people instead perceive more time and good circumstances ahead; and if times are good, they usually will have that (unless the outer circumstances -which come under the understanding of Uranus/Aquarius- punish any indolent and lazy Jupiter prominent individual). They will be more brash and careless about themselves because of how their reality and provenance has always treated them. A gambler personality.

Just wanted to clarify this as all that is on AA about both aspects focuses on the negative and this is understandable. I've seen a case with Jupiter and Saturn closely aspecting on and towards the Sun and it's particularly nasty as one's personality is pulled in both of these directions. Jupiter/Saturn aspects, particularly when involved with other planets can also be indicative of people who are afraid of travel, flying, getting homesick and so on. Clinging onto old values and wrong ways of how one was brought up.

On a final note, my understanding of this first started with "Saturn contracts, Jupiter expands" applied to this page: https://satanisgod.org/www.angelfire.com/empire/serpentis666/PlanetSun.html

Hopefully people here can get even more out of that notion as I did. HPS Maxine Dietrich has done a great service to astrologers worldwide with these webpages. Everything being discussed now in current astrologer circles is information and ideas that have scaled down from these writings.

 

[Henu the Great]

Hopefully people here can get even more out of that notion as I did. HPS Maxine Dietrich has done a great service to astrologers worldwide with these webpages. Everything being discussed now in current astrologer circles is information and ideas that have scaled down from these writings.

A moment of apprecation for Azazel is needed too!

 

[AlexElPM]

Sun/Saturn

I have a question:

What if I have the Sun and Saturn in the same sign and house, but they are NOT connected by conjunction?

 

[Karnonnos [JG]]

As far as the paternal element of this conjunct is concerned and how bad it can get, it can go anywhere from Mozart to Marvin Gaye (his synastry with his father and 10th House Saturn fucked him though, I suspect his father had Saturn in 5th too, and also Mars-Pluto issues, the conjunct is not the only part of the story).

 

[13th_Wolf]

Sun/Saturn

I have a question:

What if I have the Sun and Saturn in the same sign and house, but they are NOT connected by conjunction?

Then it's a very weak conjunction so not so effectual, but it depends on the degrees of the planets involved (do NOT reveal ANY of your degrees)

If you're saying Saturn is in the same sign AND house as the weak conjunction here it implies one of two scenarios:

1) Saturn is in early degrees, the Sun is in latter degrees of said sign

2)Saturn is in late degrees, Sun in earlier degrees of said sign

For scenario 1, Saturn has more power and is stronger. For 2, less.

If Saturn lies "under" your Sun in the stronger earlier degrees, it tapers your ego and is more grounding, one has to overcome something pressuring, with the father early on in the childhood transits. Saturn in this situation can be a serious burden if other things in the chart are supporting that, but can also be fine and actually a very positive influence if it is balanced. If you have strength in the chart, an early degree Saturn should act to amplify that.

If Saturn lies "above" and is to move away from your stronger early degree Sun, this minimises the grounding effect Saturn has and also the things you have to overcome will pertain more to later in your life, and will concern only the sign your Saturn is in with little-er effect to the Sun. With this, you are still Saturnian but like with any late planet, it indicates you have to make effort to master it yourself so with Saturn it indicates extra effort for self-discipline. No problems from the father with scenario 2, but less disciplinary pressure instead which is actually helpful.


With wide Jupiter conjunctions scenario 1 and 2 are swapped so Jupiter "under" the Sun props up and over inflates ones Ego/confidence. Malefic. Jupiter "above," the Sun should be more positive as Jupiter is a mutable planet or "3". Mutable planets should operate better in the 3rd decan(20'-30'); but anyway, it being "above" the Sun in a later degree means that it's not propping it up so to say. A weaker degree Jupiter with the Sun should actually help although the issue with overconfidence still persists in a lesser mode.

But yeah, that's something pretty close to it. If they are in the same sign.