Question #4893: Punishment is Abuse?

[AskSatanOperator]

How can you tell the difference? And what to do as a parent raising a child.

 

[Henu the Great]

Look up definitions for both of these words. There is a difference, and when there is no intent to abuse then there can not be abuse. However, there can be excessive use of force as a punishment. Wise judgment is required.

 

[NetemPtah]

In my opinion punishment should not happen between human beings. Since I was a child I have always believed that a correct parent has other means to educate, such as reward, which is a much more valid reason for behaving in an ethical manner. All that a parent should transmit is ethics, and knowledge of the laws that regulate society and one's personal being, made up of ambitions, desires and responsabilities. Punishment is bad, it causes a chain reaction of negative attitudes and dangerous situations. A child, even if dependent in some ways, is a human being, on whom too ofter the parent incorrectly exercises a tyrannical and disrespectful manner. Children are intelligent, ethical beings who recognize that they have been disrespected, even if they have no strength to do anything other than forgive. This is an all too common situation.

Children are able to see when they have made a mistake and to feel others's emotions; a parent's only job is to give them the tools to analyze, understand and act for the positive outcome without imposing the conception of what is more wrong or more correct. Children are capable of discerning, they just need to be supported. In this way a parent contributes to the strength of character of the child, who as an adult will not have to trust blindly anyone, but will be able to evaluate situations and manage the responsibilities of his own actions.


The only punishment is that of violation of natural laws, which concern karmic issues and the consequences of one's actions. But this is a different topic.

 

[Engineered Trasformation]

I think, punishment does exist in society so a kid needs to understand for highly wrong actions, there are consequences.
This should be rarely used, otherwise you will emulate the standard xian/muslim mass who punish and blame the kids for any single small fault, that creates a sense of self-inadequacy and loss of self esteem "WTF everything I do is wrong?"
I am no parent, so I can only observe this on others.

When I am in doubt, sometimes, I try to emulate the Gods.
How did the Demon X treat me in this situation What did he/she tell me or showed me? Difficult task. But emulating the Gods or even the lesser Demons actions for practical problems, is a good way to elevate own morality, as a kid would want to do emulating his/her father.

 

[Ĥl·lĥæ]

How can you tell the difference? And what to do as a parent raising a child.

the son is hit after the apology. 1 or 5 times, when doing serious things. Don't hit children when simple and silly things happen. like running, breaking a glass or messing with fire. Don't shout at your children or say bad words around them, try to show only good qualities. I was never beaten by my mother, she just punished me, but today I keep thinking about how I should have been beaten and suffered for the mistakes I made when I was young. We ourselves have thought about how we would hit our past selves with hatred because her punishment was not equal to her faults.

 

[Stormblood]

The different is intent. Abuse is meant to cause harm, punishment is meant to teach a lesson.

Punishment for children should be inherently built to make them understand the lesson. If they also lie and try to manipulate you in order to avoid punishment, this should also be embedded in a harsher punishment.

Education needs to be such as to teach children about the consequences of their own actions, whether they are favourable or not. Punishment can be employed against certain mistakes and toxic behaviours as means of building accountability.

You can only use punishment with children because their legal, moral and ethical capacity are still growing and not covered by the law.

As a parent, you're responsible for the children but, just because a children's wrong actions aren't punished by the way nor by community disapproval, it doesn't mean that they should get off scot-free.

Getting off scot-free is the opposite of education. It's teaching them that they can do bad things and nobody will held them responsible for it. Any such occurrence grows them into a dysfunctional adult (i.e. adult only by age but not behaviour). This neglect will bite them back as they won't be able to grow upright as adult, and will have a harder time advancing properly in life in general.

Neglecting proper education is the reason why so many people nowadays are easily overwhelmed by life. Their parents didn't teach them life lesson, so now they don't know how to manage themselves and their life as adults.

Nature never gives you a free out-of-jail ticket in life. You have to live with the consequences of any harm you cause to yourself and others, even for things that you don't have the awareness to understand whether they're right or wrong.

A parent's job is to make sure you turn into the healthiest adult possible. They are your main teachers when you're a child, followed by your school teachers in importance. Being a parent can be the hardest job in the world.

Neglecting this type of education is the hallmark of a toxic parent. You make a child that is unprepared to life. If this child never learns after, you start a chain of creating more and more toxic generations in your family, becoming a blight for your ancestors and descendant.

This is how you have kids nowadays that don't understand manners, how to talk to your elders, how to foster a healthy study/working environment, etc. Kids that don't know the different between playful banter and bullying. I could go on.

Then they go into work and they cannot cope, or they just take toxic inputs and enforce them in the work environment to the point they bully every more mature newcomer that wants to challenge toxic norms and create a healthier environment. And similarly in school.

Which toxic behaviours need to be corrected by punishment and which can just be replaced in lighter ways, it will vary depending on the gravity of your children's behaviour and their own awareness.

Parents should ideally make sure they are as mature as possible and the way they educate is as proper as possible as well. Seek education in this, such as from sermons and experienced member replies here. And always understand that you don't know everything as well and you need to keep learning "on the job", as hardly anyone nowadays as a natural talent for parenting and the highest level of wisdom and ethics.

If I was a parent and, for example, my child pushed a kid down the stairs for no legitimate reason, I would do something like this:

1. Have a chat to make sure they are aware what they've done is wrong
2. (let's pretend they are) Make sure they start by apologising properly to the kid (not just saying sorry but something heartfelt and complete)
3. Then, if the other kid's parents allow, they need to be in charge of helping the kid and tending to them until they are in good health again, and beyond that being extra helpful to them to make amends.
4. They would also be supervised for a period of varying length to make sure I don't see that behaviour repeated again.

This is a simple example. If my child didn't understand why what they've done is wrong and feel remorseful, it would be a different story. Same if they refused to comply, as being a child they have no right to refuse to rectify their behaviour.

With all things, as we're all different, methods of education change. But there's nothing wrong when punishment is used to correct wrong behaviours.

 

[AFODO]

In my opinion punishment should not happen between human beings. Since I was a child I have always believed that a correct parent has other means to educate, such as reward, which is a much more valid reason for behaving in an ethical manner. All that a parent should transmit is ethics, and knowledge of the laws that regulate society and one's personal being, made up of ambitions, desires and responsabilities. Punishment is bad, it causes a chain reaction of negative attitudes and dangerous situations. A child, even if dependent in some ways, is a human being, on whom too ofter the parent incorrectly exercises a tyrannical and disrespectful manner. Children are intelligent, ethical beings who recognize that they have been disrespected, even if they have no strength to do anything other than forgive. This is an all too common situation.

Children are able to see when they have made a mistake and to feel others's emotions; a parent's only job is to give them the tools to analyze, understand and act for the positive outcome without imposing the conception of what is more wrong or more correct. Children are capable of discerning, they just need to be supported. In this way a parent contributes to the strength of character of the child, who as an adult will not have to trust blindly anyone, but will be able to evaluate situations and manage the responsibilities of his own actions.


The only punishment is that of violation of natural laws, which concern karmic issues and the consequences of one's actions. But this is a different topic.

Read this: https://ancient-forums.com/threads/learning-respect-and-freedom.96464/

If someone can only learn trough the hard way, than they must go trough it.

 

[Dragonheart666]

Especially nowadays with children! Thinking that they could just do what they want, having very little to no respect for their elders. And the fact that they take advantage of their parents and don't listen. I honestly think the kids nowadays deserve to be punished and spanked and taught some serious lessons about how to take responsibility. And to respect and love their parents and to be loyal with those that are older than them. And those that are smart that are trying to teach them guide them and direct them. Kids nowadays think that they can do whatever they want they think they can have whatever they want regardless. Whether they are worthy of it or not. Especially in this day and age. We're back in my generation? If I wanted anything! I would have to go out and work for it and earn the money to get it. And I respected my parents. And if I got my butt spanked it was because I deserved it. And believe me if I got the punishment I know very well why I got it and how I got it. And even at that time I respected it because I know what I did to bring it on and I took responsibility for my problems and my attitude. Kids nowadays don't even give a care. They just want what they want in spite of the rules. And they don't even know what lies ahead of them in the future. Other than the fact that they're going to be the future fugitives and criminals. All because of the lack of punishment. And because the Millennials didn't believe in spanking their kids? When they should have.

 

[NetemPtah]

Read this: https://ancient-forums.com/threads/learning-respect-and-freedom.96464/

If someone can only learn trough the hard way, than they must go trough it.

Thanks for tagging me and reminding me of the topic addressed by HP Hoodedcobra666. I totally agree, but even the very act of learning through the hard ways (even through our human relationships) is a manifestation of what we have sown, and what we are reaping. This refers to the ethics I was talking about. In fact, this is a type of awareness that the parent/educator must transmit to their children/people, so that they have the opportunity to understand how to remedy situations by understanding the causes, and consequently being ethical beings. Unfortunately what is missing is the awareness of the correct, or the negative. The enemy has sown confusion on the ethical question, which has a profound impact on our soul.
However, mere punishment will not be enough to dissolve this confusion. You need someone to take you by the hand and accompany you towards knowledge, like all those who contribute here to making this, which is Satan's will, possible for human beings.
Karmic punishment/consequence is inevitable as the everything is made of laws, but the only way to escape from this vicious circle is knowledge, and even through hard episodes, verify the acquired awareness.